Transcript from MPAC Forum on Partnership of Muslim Americans and Law Enforcement

February 11, 2011


Haris Tarin: I like to welcome you on behalf of the council. This event is timely important events and just wanted make a few introductory remarks before I hand the mic over to [Indiscernible] [0:00:12] absolutely. As, you know, [Indiscernible] [0:00:16] policy, advocacy organization will [Indiscernible] [0:00:21] opinion and policy by serving of the trusted resource to decision makers and government and policy institutions in Washington D.C.  It is our believe there are community needs proactive voices in  institutions which seemed to informed policies before they are formed. And that policy formation takes place here in the house of these buildings.

Engaging in the policy debate in conversation before they are formed whether they placed in the House of Congress on Capitol Hill or within various departments within the administration.  Requires a sustained effort of engaging it that seeks long term changes that reflect two positions aspirations of our community and our country of mark. Today’s program is entirely partnership or confrontation Muslims Law Enforcement and National Security in the post 9/11 era.  We are the Muslim Public Affairs Council believe that this [Indiscernible] [0:01:25] and timely conservation which needs to be had an open and transparent form. 

As many of you know already this topic has been discussed and will continue to be discussed both within the house of this institution, The United States Congress and in our Public discourse and debate. We believe that is our role as a Muslim-American policy institution to provide a new ones effective on the issues of national security and the role the Muslim American Community that Muslim really can play in keeping our country safe and secure.  Here we also believe that we must do this with keeping our most cherished principals and heart that a free and open society is the greatest annecdite to any form of extremists violence.

So, please do take part in this interactive session in engage our prolific panel, I will introduce to you the moderator for today’s forum, Sohail Khan.  Mr. Khan is the senior fellow for Muslim, Christian understanding at the Institute for Global Engagement.  Mr. Khan was previously a senior appointee at the Bush administration.  Sohail.

[Soundbite of applause]

Sohail Khan:  Thanks Mark. [Indiscernible] [0:02:45] I know you are up with the lunch but hopefully we’ll have a great enlightening conversation.  This is very timely topic as far as outline and thanks for allow me to part of this very important and timely conservation. And I thought we’ll go right into the introductions for our panel and that way we will get them ample time to make their opening remarks and we will go right to UNA. 

As far as outline, we are blessed today with a stellar panel of experts each growing to the discussion very important experience both in research and  in hands on grass roots work on this particular field.  First time we have Peter Bergan, this American print and television journalist and author and CNN international security analyst.  Mr. Bergan produced the first television interview with Osama Bin Laden in 1997 and the interview was aired on CNN and marked first time that Bin Laden declared war against the United States with western audience.  Mr. Bergan has written three books, Holy War, Inc. and The Osama bin Laden I Know, The Longest War: The Enduring Conflict Between America and Al Qaeda.

Next step, we have deputy chief Michael Downing, who is the commanding officer for counter terrorism at the criminal intelligence at bereau where he leads two operational division [Indiscernible] [0:04:35] emergency service division, understand that chief chief Michael Downing, was not able to join us. So, I’ll skip the [Indiscernible] [0:04:48].

Next, we have Mr. Roger Presse, well I do know he is here, former member of the United States National Security Council. [Indiscernible] [0:04:58] director for National Threat from November 1999 through November 2001. And he was formal department consulting group but now he has just joined [Indiscernible] [0:05:07] announcing that public and he doesn’t have a business card as yet, don’t ask him. And from my home State of California we were joined by Sheriff Leroy D. Baca who is the Sheriff of Los Angeles County in California. Sheriff Baca holds Doctorate of Public Administration from University of Southern California and Sheriff Baca was elected to LA County’s 30th chair of Sheriff. He is an old mentor in certain blog [Indiscernible] [0:05:37] prior to election but remained on the ballot.  He was sworn in on December 07, 1998 and he was re-elected for a fourth term in 2010.  Then we have Alejandro Botto of Ampack, who is Ampack government and policy analyst.  Alejandro has authored several academic papers, articles and reports on topics ranging from Islam, International Security, Women’s liberty and democratization. He is the author of Ampack’s counter terrorist report building bridges to strengthen America and also the author of Ampack’s post 9/11 terrorism incident with the  data base. So, those are our panels, I’m going to start Mr. Bergan and we will look in. Mr. Bergan.

Peter Bergan:  Thanks you. Thank you Ampack and those invitation, I mean there is an opening observation successful and it is great that Amoack is having [Indiscernible] [0:06:39]. So, I think is good that we are hearing from this man, and there is no pretend that there isn’t a problem that exists in the Muslim American Community. At the same time that small attempted [Indiscernible] [0:06:52].  The American foundation has served a Jihadi terrorist cases since 9/11. We haven’t reached the goal as yet, we found about 183 cases, charge with convictions and people charged in terrorism catered with sort of Jihadist flavor.

Few times in the [Indiscernible] [0:07:17] large number of cases since 9/11, 43 cases that made slightly effected by  the fact that lot Somali American, always Somali Americans from due to travel to Somalia were charged. The fact is that 2009 with kind of largest year with this type of cases that we seen since 9/11. In 2010 the numbers drop to about 24. So, the real question before us is in some sense it was 2009 outlined all part of the packet and I see it’s probably [Indiscernible] [0:07:53].

There are some interesting take ways from report which we anticipate and publish in the next couple of weeks, one in 183 cases the reporting back for another chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear clearly fall aspire to do this [Indiscernible] [0:08:14] attacks, underlying the kind of threat [Indiscernible] [0:08:19] and in fact in early very serious case I’m aware of since 9/11 somebody trying to really had the means with right time to materials such as [Indiscernible] [0:08:32] motivate ideas.

Another interesting take away from the report is that really is much profile, you know, you’re familiar with the case if you had change but if you go through the case is particular in recent years that Somali Americans or Afghan Americans are [Indiscernible] [0:08:57] they cover every kind of educational profile, estimate profile, age profile. And so profile and general concept is a general principal is an objective we saw by looking at this problem.

Another thing that you, another interesting take way maybe from the recent cases the diversity of the [Indiscernible] [0:09:23]. So, there is a group it’s not just al-Qaeda, it can be national al-Qaeda, it can be Hugi, it can be Pakistani Taliban, it can be [Indiscernible] [0:09:31] there are all different kinds of groups.  The other take away from the report include the, well, I think the one thing is little surprising is not entirely new. This is the fact that Americans are taking kind of leadership role in number of these groups and this is not unprecedented value and it was the chief trainer for al-Qaeda before 9/11 was graduated, he was a U.S. army [Indiscernible] [0:10:00] professional warfare syndrome, [Indiscernible] [0:10:03] was a Lebanese American, Bin Laden’s personal secretary before 9/11 before he was arrested in [Indiscernible] [0:10:14].

So, it’s not unprecedented but we do have Americans planning important roles in these groups whether it was Hedley before he was arrested in [Indiscernible] [0:10:21] in al-Qaeda central who reports throughout in Florida. But it was a great observations about the kind of some of the details of these cases in one knock I want to share just a probably reflect a larger al-Qaeda threat in general.  I know that [Indiscernible] [0:10:57] a little bit as well.   The kinds of cancer we worried about are pretty small scale rather speaking [Indiscernible] [0:11:06] these kinds of attacks might be Times Square which [Indiscernible] [0:11:13] succeeded to kill thousands of people if [Indiscernible] [0:11:16] killed about 300 people. I think that we are looking at attacks that kill thousands if al-Qaeda is lucky and brings down American passenger jets somewhere in the world which I think is totally [Indiscernible] [0:11:30] still making bombs that can target more American planes.

Then he might be looking at lot of death toll but the main point is that these attacks are not [Indiscernible] [0:11:49] 9/11. I think we have to prepare ourselves to the idea that nobody suicide attacker in United States I think will be [Indiscernible] [0:11:57] otherwise the reason I say that is the British kind of talk at this phenomenon will not come to our shore, [Indiscernible] [0:12:05] and if I made that kind of official conclusion until 7/7 of course forwarded suicide attacks on 7/7. We have these two American suicidal operation oversees in Somalia and I think it would once it happens overseas it [Indiscernible] [0:12:21].

U.S. military targets remained domestically obviously a people find up by Jihadi ideology whether it was a little more conclusion standard where [Indiscernible] [0:12:32] American solder at that time before these case [Indiscernible] [0:12:37] quantitative face was has yet still [Indiscernible] [0:12:43] and of course do practice [Indiscernible] [0:12:47] in the post 9/11 era one reason I think we haven’t seen enough tension is that the guys [Indiscernible] [0:12:57]. So, it was a group of people with money, motivation, weapons, serious plan to attack but U.S. military recruiting stations in California and [Indiscernible] [0:13:08].  All of the attacks and just places that are anywhere as the U.S. [Indiscernible] [0:13:17] al-Qaeda or I don’t think so maybe somebody [Indiscernible] [0:13:20] trying such attacks but the all is that al-Qaeda and it’s allies we try to [Indiscernible] [0:13:28] try to remind you, they are trying to speak to people who are out of Washington and New York and understand American commercial engagements but they are not speaking to be people and they are trying to engage with [Indiscernible] [0:13:41] some  smaller amount in town.  So, we see again and again that New York, Los Angeles and some degree Washington D.C [Indiscernible] [0:13:51].

On final point I think is this, our own reaction is complaining to whatever happen next, I mean, there are three things that are true and it is very hard things, very hard things for a politician to say. Because [Indiscernible] [0:14:09] comprehension why is al-Qaeda is not individual, al-Qaeda’s alliance, don’t pose anything [Indiscernible] [0:14:18] the United States government is doing a great deal protect the population. At the same time by all averages the – an attack will happen. So, the question is, you know, preparing ourselves as a society and so that we don’t have some protest over reaction because when the attack happens that we haven’t prepared the ground for United States wants to stand but the attacks [Indiscernible] [0:14:45] smaller scale but we don’t need to replace our entire constitutional framework because the attacked gone through. And we see who misses so I think [Indiscernible] [0:14:56] responses by the Obama administration for instance, we have 14 countries on the extra scrutiny list, I mean [Indiscernible] [0:15:05] people coming out of Britain on the extra scrutiny list and I will see only [Indiscernible] [0:15:10] attack again after all we’re completely saying this has been [Indiscernible] [0:15:15] involved and France to attack next. Well, Britain was on the list unless itself is a stupid idea and luckily the administration offer a few months actually and a changes policy on our front. So, the final point is our [Indiscernible] [0:15:28] reactions to al-Qaeda work for us if were not capital and constructed [Indiscernible] [0:15:34] when it happens.

Sohail Khan:  Thanks Peter. Before I ask Sheriff Baca I want to offer the [Indiscernible] [0:15:49] first do come up here please. Sheriff Lee Baca.

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  Well, thank you and good afternoon. I’m delighted to be here, Los Angeles is a lot warmer…

[Soundbite of laughter]

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  But it’s nice to see so many young professionals in the room. I would like to start with few assumptions post 9/11 and speak to policy issues as well as the approach that we use in Los Angeles County relative to how to build a strong and sacred community. [Indiscernible] [0:16:34] in the 9/11 attack America was totally off guard somewhat stunt and astounded by what occurred and definitely went through growing period and it’s unprecedented history of this country in the modern sense of the countries age.

My assumption, my first assumption was that Americans were looking at this as a, as a problem of trust with each other. When I came to, you know, debate [Indiscernible] [0:17:13] and I think that remarkably I think the nation is initially very united like during the 9/11 experience that everybody was pulling together and it was commonly know that all faiths were and the World Trade Center and all faiths had lost representatives and to say. So, that was the new defined course but then this [Indiscernible] [0:17:39] is noted for bringing out a variety of opinions very fast as to what is causable all this.

And that became a in my opinion a memorable ground swelling of, of concern by Muslim-Americans as to who is been blamed with this. And that parallel impaired I think was to evacuate in terms of national policy and took awhile I think for pressman in the country to come out and make clear statement of that Islam is not a terrorist organization or nor is belonging mentor of terrorism. And so, the question is what did the local police do and, you know, it is much that the Federal government extensively responsible for all intelligence gathering and it was enough intelligence and about the plotters that did the 9/11 attack.

And the question was they couldn’t collect the dots and [Indiscernible] [0:18:44] we ended up with all [Indiscernible] [0:18:50] and connecting dots and so forth so on but the question still remains is that, I have all the staffing when using a national date work that basically was unconnected to the local law enforcement. And so, those list in local law enforcement realize that we have more resources, we have more relationships with the public than the federal government.

And so we quickly went into action right the day after 9/11 and posted genre the Mayor of Los Angeles and members of the [Indiscernible] [0:19:24] supervisors and all the inter faith community particularly the Muslim-Americans in Los Angeles county to talk about how we’re going to prevent backlash because the fear of backlash was another one concerned, we couldn’t do anything about the attacks, the attacks occurred and [Indiscernible] [0:19:45] and, you know, we had to shut the airlines down and we essentially had done, I guess the national basis what had to be done.

But the question is out of the people here about their own sense of safety and security, you know, they can be singled out of those criticism. What we’ve found that Pakistani-Americans in Southern California [Indiscernible] [0:20:11] stores and customers were staring at them and basically insulting them and maybe listed remarks as to what he must be happy now or something like this. And, of course, this is not something that these individual storeowners felt was warranted and back.

It was offensive and quite frankly threatening to them. So, so, we got [Indiscernible] [0:20:39] in Southern California and we had invaded this [Indiscernible] [0:20:42] stores and we had the address isn’t so forth. And we offer support to them and in anyplace suspicious coming their way in real threats or actions and, you know, watching windows and like we would, we would either in support of their right to be protected. From there it evolved the first I think the series of steps that is necessary, one, that the non Muslim society in America were rumbling underneath and certainly not so underneath the media stream about what is Muslim demand.

And so, we got together with some significant Muslim leaders in Southern California and we’ve, you know, [Indiscernible] [0:21:32] the council of American Islamic relations the greater Los Angeles area, Council of [Indiscernible] [0:21:37] American Muslims Association, North America, Islam [Indiscernible] [0:21:43] Islamic Shia Council of Southern California, the Muslim American Society, Muslim Public Affairs Council [Indiscernible] [0:21:57] and together they form and we have college students from UCLA and university along with the business organization.

We form this Muslim-American Homeland Security Congress which was far away of saying that Muslim Americans at least in Southern California are part of the protected fabric America and that we wanted to make sure that there were certain things that was going on and so the core value of this organization is just as moderation, education, peace. And co-operation and I think that there is a key to, to the voice of the Muslim American Society needed a [Indiscernible] [0:22:46] around something is very clear that Muslims are not tolerating terrorist that American Muslims are mainstream professionally, educationally and socially and we don’t have ghettos of any large quantities that you have a positive community in [Indiscernible] [0:23:08] Muslim were judges.

Muslims were city council members, Muslims were very mainstream but this was a community that step from Henry Ford who offered a jobs to [Indiscernible] [0:23:24] societies because we have American who to make model [Indiscernible] [0:23:30]. So, but our only major community that could be described as significant in Muslim was in those communities in around Detroit. So, the first point is that community values are such that in Los Angeles you have every nationality, every religion, every race and there by Los Angeles because of it’s size about million people, four million people more than New York in terms of the county size, the most significant Asian society in outside of Asia in Los Angeles that we felt that community values are something that we had to encourage and defend and support and what is that community value was diversely is that all faiths did it and construct and of our national values, we’re national values, national values are essentially are constitution or build rights and civil rights and then from my prospective law enforcement person threw in human rights because there is a need to recognize it in this great nation of ours there was a reality [Indiscernible] [0:24:49]. There was a reality of in turn with the Japanese more or two, there was a reality that Chinese were imported and for neighbor purposes anyone I love becomes citizen, married and property and do anything in regards to voting. There is a reality that in 1920 women were allowed nationally to vote in elections and before that were not. So, we’ve had a lot of evolutionary improvement in our country but make a mistake that in the states in past they were forgotten because we permitted in the future and our biggest concerned in L.A. was that we do not want the Muslim American society to feel like they will be held responsible for terrorists attacks.

And yet in the world of public opinion you keep on trying to sample with American public opinions, you will get a variety of opinions that for the most part positive there are significant player not positive. And so, law enforcement therefore has to do more to ensure that everyone American rights are guaranteed. So, we formed a Muslim granted, Muslim community [Indiscernible] [0:26:01], you know, a man here, sheriff Moris, stand up a little bit here so, here is the guy…

[Soundbite of laughter]

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  He born in Egypt, and is a sergeant, he is a, he is a Palestinian and, of course, all of the think about outreach is that there is, you know, well over 15 [Indiscernible] [0:26:27] in California and he got like young people, you got probably students, you got parents [Indiscernible] [0:26:33] everybody that the guy have relationships and so we’re using a community trust policing model, community trust policing model but not intelligence would, not something is mechanical, you know, constant or whatever.

It is all about relationship, its’ all about friendship and therefore public trust policing to me is not prophesizing the community we’ve got. But to give the community the linkage to, to us that if any feel threatened by something suspicious such as young man in the family is becoming radical in this conversation, that they will feel comfortable to come forward and say, you know, what? You will know what to do. And, of course, we heard appropriate example of a community member here and next going who said there is remark, that it was a Sheriff that talk was mentally ill man who try to kill his mother, he had also got a couple of aggressive fights intently and he need mental health and so the Sheriff taught him and [Indiscernible] [0:28:02] himself. Well, you know, we know predictive lot of these people who committed [Indiscernible] [0:28:07] are mentally off.

They are not really sound anything, they were very vague, the faith has done [Indiscernible] [0:28:15] mental in capacity exactly human being they are losing it. And so this going to be a meaning stone. Well, that’s a high example of public trust policing, I think I’ve said what I wanted to say initially, last point is that we have a leadership group with the college students and we believe that dialog and interaction of ideas are key way of building trust and that America will be safer when it doesn’t stereotype or scapegoat individuals because probably with their dress and I’m sensitive with that because the Sikh community, there is a plenty of people that don’t see Sikh’s in the right way, to see Sikh’s as, as being Muslims went back, you know, the proportion of Hinduism. And so, lastly in order to bump all these face a little bit in terms of the minds of the Los Angeles County public I thought of advocate council of all the faith, 500 Rabbi, ministers, Imams, Buddhist monks and like and same [Indiscernible] [0:29:33]. And…

Speaker:  Tom Cruise.

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  Yeah. He is there.

[Soundbite of laughs]

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  Tom Cruise, he is a cool dude, you know.

[Soundbite of laughter]

Sheriff Leroy D. Baca:  He is the right guy, very loving guy. The point is that all the place in Los Angeles have the key obligation and keen sense of commitment to each other that the fundamental point to conclude with, you would have learn all these face, I’ll tell you, they don’t mind either [Indiscernible] [0:30:04], they don’t mind either in Catholic, oh we Catholic by the way. So, I’ve got model of, you know, the best Catholic and possibly fine, I’m willing to get I got ways to go. And that sense of respect to teach me open to everybody else’s faith and as a result of that I believe that all of us here particularly in lot [Indiscernible] [0:30:30] thing.

The great thing about God, is God is a creator and [Indiscernible] [0:30:43] love and most definitely all love is about patrons. And there is no such thing as dragging God into mass murders ways, that’s the way I live. And so whoever, whoever wants to get an argument about ideology, not that I read ideology and this is going to [Indiscernible] [0:31:02] ideology right to the point and that is that we have an obligation in non violence and you can be. We have an obligation do not kill, we have a obligation to settle our disputes in a way that it is non violent. And I believe that anybody that thinks that they are going to drag God or any religion into murderous task is a person is worthy of being a self side for well, was in captivity or whether it moral institution or whatever they belong so they can get their proper help. But anyone who thinks that they can kill another human being in the name of God is acting as though they are God. And I think there is a need for us to back away from specifics and individual faiths and jeopardize to the point that human being that are driving this violence. Thank you.

Speaker:  Thanks Sheriff Baca. He is supposed to come in back, we have about eight to ten minutes here at the front, if you want to walk away down in the front, please do and [Indiscernible] [0:32:10].

Alejandro Botto:  Thanks and straight in, two reasons really – first is having you all here today and second is because, of course, yesterday there was the Super Bowl attackers one. So, now coming in to the things that my boss is going to be quite happy that there he is well. So, again and that’s a good start, everything is set when the boss is happy, you know, then you have a big event, you come with your clear mind. But anyway thanks a lot for coming here today.

My remarks we’re going to focus on three areas here out of respect to what we’re going to be talking about. The first is identifying the policy challenges that we as a nation and as an American faith community, as Muslim-Americans face. The second really is to provide an internal assessment of those challenges. And then the third is really to sort of address well, what our Muslim communities is doing to tackle the issue of violent extremism.

So, again the challenge of, the challenge of extremism we as a nation, as a Muslim-American faith community face really is two fold. First is that there is an ideological component, there is ideological extremism which is when individuals or groups come to intellectually approve of new survivors that like the sitting audience for political aims. And that’s different from the second aspect which is violent extremism. Violent extremists are people who explicitly encourage or make access violence or provide logistical support violence.

Now, individuals in the first category engage in legally protected free speech or other legal activities but may at here to an extremist group. People in the second category on the other hand are engaged in violent and other illegal forms of activity. Because at this dual dilemma law enforcement can either go alone nor a rested square at this challenge. Therefore partnership with Muslim-American communities to deal with this issue is an imperative one. And this is especially the case when we look at how al-Qaida has transformed itself into a defuse movement rather than just simply being an organization as PR has just explained earlier on the panel.

Now, in past strategy to all of these is outlining his amateurs and policy favor, building bridges to strengthen America. We just have a partnership but one that is guided by division of labor between law enforcement and communities. Law enforcement must remain focused on disrupting violent activity and logistical support. Meanwhile Muslim communities must continue to uphold their civic and religious obligations to combat extremists toxic narratives by increasing the sophistication of the anti extremism activities.

So, with that said what is my assessment of this threat and the challenges that opposes. Well, I think it will be clear to say that our head only understand, the threat clearly exists but I also want to put in prospective and say that [Indiscernible] [0:35:31] pandemic. The threat exists but it is not pandemic. As 9/11 showed us terrorism is a very deadly issue and one that people had good reason to be concerned about it. However, the weight we as a nation analyze this challenge is going to be extremely important.

We must need or under estimate nor over estimate the challenge, either extreme plays into the terrorist hands by giving them too much or too little credit. Therefore what we’re saying is let the data meet the discourse. So, what does the data exactly said? Tracking done by a recent duke study that just came out last week found that it was a sharp decline in the total number of people arrested in the previous year. The study found in 2009 that over 47 suspects arrested but in 2010 only 20 suspects were arrested [Indiscernible] [0:36:30] 57 percent drop.

As a result the studies offers had concluded that the previous year 2009 was more of an admiration that in track. Now, well, this is certainly good news there is also an important limitation to what the report and it’s data actually says. If you study head analyzed individuals that may, who have jumped the fence from legally protected activities into explicitly violent criminal pursuits. Some observers had pointed to despite of arrests as a possible evidence not only of as evidence from rising violent extremism but also as a rising trying to grown ideological extremism among Muslim-Americans.

So, never to address this question and other questions related to violent extremism and ideological extremism within the United States. Ampak has a monthly project called post 9/11 terrorism incident database. Our database is a statistical and cross ideological study of all mass casualty, violent extremism plus threatening to United States sin 9/11. So, we’re not nearly lean ourselves to the tough really terrorists such as al-Qaida and it’s affiliates who really try to keep it to a comparative prospective looking at even a non Muslim right wing and other individuals here within the United States to try and give a comprehensive sort of analysis.

Now, more information on the sources and the methodology is provided in the folder. So, I’m not going to get dealt too much into the details. But more to the point is that according to our database what we did, is we use President Obama’s election at the start of the timeline to measure any sort of possible trends. Now, based on public sources that we use in our database we found that 50 out of the 20 post election thoughts were 75 percent involve Muslim-Americans engaging in ideological extremism both for the presidential votes.

Now, out of this 20, 11 percent were a majority or engaged in ideological extremism since at least 2007, that’s about 55 percent. Only two out of the 20 cases were 10 percent are individuals probably know to be involved in extremist activities after the president’s election. And, of course, three cases were 15 percent remain unknown. In other words when the data is pointing towards is that al-Qaida does not appear to be making new ideological in rows within the American Muslim community.

Instead the data is point towards greater numbers of long standing ideological extremists turning to violence. So, based on this analysis of the problem and the internal assessment what exactly are Muslim Americans do? Just to be very briefly with the limited time I have left I got to focus on how communities are combating violence extremism. Now, recently there have been some concerns raised about the extent to which Muslim communities have not co-operated with law enforcement to combat violent extremism. Many times we may here anecdotal reports of tensions between federal law enforcement in some communities. There are [Indiscernible] [0:39:50] concerns and the perceptions segmented with very, very real about government overreach and head to head heavy hand attackers, particularly on the question of informant infiltration of communities.  And while these incidents do occur, they only tell part of the story between law enforcement and Muslim communities.  In fact, our research, the [0:40:15.8] [inaudible] _ terrorism database finds that Muslim-American communities have actually done significant amounts of partnership with law enforcement to combat violent extremism.  [0:40:28.4] [inaudible] _ database found since 9/11 nearly 4 out of 10 Al-Qaeda-related plots threatening the United States, has been foiled with the assistance of Muslim communities.  Within the past year, since December 2009, with the arrests of the so called DC-5, Muslim assistance increased to three quarters of all plots prevented.  Outside of the impact study, Duke found that the Muslim community assistance was responsible for providing the initial information leading to 48 out of all 120 post 9/11 suspects arrested equal to roughly 40%.

Interestingly, what the Duke study also found, was that communities with the largest single source of information leading to arrests more so than even government investigations that use importance. So while there is much commentary on the spike of arrests in 2009, a parallel and mush less-noticed spike of Muslim community assistance was simultaneously occurring. Clearly, this is very good news for those concerned about the issue. Nonetheless, some caviats and cautions warranted, again, relations between many communities and law enforcement are strained and trust does need to be strengthened.  However, the results from the studies do show that Muslim Americans are willing and able partners in the fight against violent extremism. Recently, Congress, in a bi-partisan and unanimous standing ovation fashion, was quite right to support President Obama when he  said in his most recent State of Union Address the following: 

“ As extremists try to inspire acts of violence within our borders, we are responding with the strength of our communities with respect for the rule of law and with the conviction that Muslim Americans are part of our American community.”

So with that, I’ll end my remarks. That you very much for your time, and I’ll look forward to your questions.

Male Speaker 2: Thank you [0:42:54.9] [inaudible]   and the rest of [0:42:57.4] [inaudible]  .

Male Speaker 3: Talk about football but spring training is five days away so…[ 0:43:06.4] [inaudible]  our reporting, I’d rather…as much as you’d like to avoid ideological fights, but Bostonians and New Yorks are giving us something…It can’t be avoided. So, all comments…Let me give just a couple of perspectives on your admin. I look forward here and what’s all on your minds. Now [0:43:25.2] [inaudible]   did a good job outlining all the different flavors we’ve seen of the domestic threat and how it’s evolved.  One that particularly caught my attention was last year, when two individuals were arrested in JFK who were looking to go overseas and…let me give you one paragraph on them… One name was identified as Muhammed Alesa, 20 years old,  a US citizen of Palestinian descent. And the other was Carlos Almante, 24, a naturalized US citizen who was born in Dominican republic. They were both looking to fly to Somalia to fight for Al [0:43:57.9] [inaudible]   . Now if you had told me 10 years ago, when I was at the Whitehouse, working this issue, that the potential evolves to the point where you had an American and Palestinian descent, a naturalized American from the Dominican Republic going to Somalia to fight for Al Shebab? I’d say you need to change your medication. That was not a threat, but it speaks to where we are right now and it speaks to the importance of, you can’t profile this… So, we can just dispense with that right now.  What we’ve also seen is that of all the significant plots, be it negligible as I’ve seen,, finds [0:44:35.3] [inaudible]   …Hassan…All of them were driven by different motivating factors. There’s no broad base assessment you can draw here. So, we gotta get out of what we used to call Pentagon, the BFO’s ( the blinding flashes of the Obvious), and cut it down to there’s no one size that fits all for this issue on domestic radicalization. I think the other issue here we need to deal with it, and everyone’s has eluded to…is that in the 2003/2000 up to 2008 time frame when Europe was going through this tremendous problem, nearly every major Western…actually, every Western European nation either  had a plot, had one that successfully conducted or was able to disrupt it. We here in the United States who follow counter territory, we kind of patted ourselves in the back for we say, we don’t have this problem. Our Muslim community is so completely assimilated into our society and our culture that we do not have the same problem. And the answer is, we don’t have the same problem, which is qualitatively different in Europe as what we’re dealing with here in the United States, but nonetheless, we do have a problem. So we need to figure out how to properly frame it, how to properly put it into context and then I think we can do a better job of assessing it... You know, as I look at the threat, there are three circles to the threat, A,B…Inner circle, inner charge is Al Qaeda central, the group that attacked us in 9-11, and the United States government’s got a pretty fantastic play with dealing with that. We can…webinars have been successful but they’ve got a good playbook right? The next circle out is the Al Qaeda affiliates that brought our Al Qaeda network and there are , of course, groups like AQAP is the one that we’re most worried about, and that’s an interesting combination where the US has a playbook that works but doesn’t work completely well, because the limits the United States has in persuading other governments to do what we want them to do. And then, the broader circle is for us sports fans in the audience, the unrestricted free agents. All  these individuals who’ve been radicalized for a variety of different reasons ,but yet, we have to come up with a playbook for dealing with that. That is that playbook that the US government is the weakest, for a variety of reasons, and it’s the one that we need to be focusing on more. I think the good news is, the law enforcement community, the intelligence community understand that. We’ve had a series of   successes over the past couple of years. We are involved in our approach to deal with how threat has evolved and how the US government, federal, state and local level needs to respond in kind. A couple of points here to keep in mind when we look at this issue of the domestic problem. One is, the greatest counter terrorism advantage that we have is when potential terrorists communicate and they travel. And when they don’t do either one of those things, it really makes it more difficult for the United States government at any level, to identify these people. So sooner or later, some of these guys are gonna get smart enough and they’re gonna be able to communicate and they’re not gonna travel and then we’re all faced with the question, “How do we identify them?” And folks, the issue is not going to be through national technical means, human intelligence or any type of program that the defense department and the intelligence committee has. It’s gonna be through something else, something I’M t sure if [0:47:54.0] [inaudible]   talked about which I’ll get too in a second. That is the longer term challenge here. The other issue we have here is how to identify the radicalization process with individuals as early as possible in that process. Before I used to talk about the kind of. ..we’re challenged overseas is the fed[0:48:13.9] [inaudible]   strategy. Individuals were being radicalized either on the fence and deciding whether or not they want to go operational. So, from a foreign perspective, how do we keep potential opportunist on the non-active side of the fence? Now we’ve got a similar situation here in the United States. What is our [0:48:33.0 strategies. How to identify these individuals and keep them on the non-active this side of the fence. I expect people to be upset. I expect sad processions of victimization, of anger, of displacement in any community, Muslim or other wise, just happen…What I would to identify is when these individuals trip to the other side of operation…and that is not just something that the law enforcement community will do. Now, where are some of the big problems that we have right now. We all know technology. Technology is our friend.  Technology is also our adversary. We see for years what Al qaeda has done to technology. They been incredibly adept. Typically, they are  ahead of the United States government, and that’s a bipartisan observation, republican and democrat. ..and using technology to further their own message. The fact that their message is fundamentally and morally bankrupt is irrelevant. The fact is that they’re able to get it out there and shake…and we need to do a better job on that. So I look at things…like social media I look at my Space, FaceBook, Twitter, and we need to be thinking about how we use at the local level, social media, to better identify individuals who are susceptible to radicalization and might be going down that road.   [0:49:46.6] [inaudible]  had a Facebook page. He had thousands of followers. Some of those followers were from the United States. Does that make them all potential terrorists operatives? Of course not. But what’s the US Government’s role in identifying individuals who look at [0:50:02.8 facebook page, which of course, not to take it down but, don’t be something…very, very difficult problem. I think the issue here is, people like [0:50:14.8] [inaudible]   are very ingenious in using the mediums available to them, to get out their message aimed at persuasion and radicalization. And I believe [0:50:24.4] [inaudible]   is the most dangerous individual there right now and here is why. What’s the difference between [0:50:31.2 and [0:50:32.2] [inaudible]   you talk about [0:50:32.9] [inaudible]   for years. [0:50:32.9] [inaudible]    gets…he puts on his audio, his video statements. He has not, in fact if anybody in the United States that I know of,  Nobody including [0:50:42.4] [inaudible]   said and said, now I see the light. He gets this stupid kid from California who has no absolute bearing of credibility , but inside and out, it  states  and International [0:50:56.8] [inaudible]   is the exact opposite. Respected e-mom, religious scholar, he understands shrewdly and creatively. Hot tape this long, repackage I and do it in a way with that kids with tremendous credibility. So if you look at [0:51:10.6] [inaudible]   Hassan,  if you look at [0:51:15.0] [inaudible]   Faizal Azhad,  All of these individual were influenced in one way or another by [0:51:20.1] [inaudible]  . So when I think about the threat and it’s evolved and what we should do about it. I’m thinking about how would I deal with someone with [0:51:26.9] [inaudible]   and other individuals who are going to come along like him. In coming up with a strategy and approach for neutralizing their message in a way that benefits all of us. Now, I think that other part of this of course is the proxy versus security. We cam spent all day, in the next week and in the next year going for the proxy and security debate. I think there has been a lack of maturity on this debate that’s absolutely obscene. Well I love being in the legislative branch. They have not done enough to have a mature debate on Proxy vs. Security. It is your responsibility, It is your obligation to do this better, because if we do not have a proper debate on proxy vs. securities, yet again, after a potential attack or god-forbid, a successful attack. We’re going to be using a sledgehammer to deal with your response when scalp should be required. So, come on folks, get on with it. This is not an…we can talk about these issues, but we need to do a better job on proxy and vs. security. So, here are the two things that I would love to see congress do in dealing with this issue? The first is, [0:52:37.3] [inaudible]   broke the cup. This is about community based, releasing community based relationships. If you’re gonna deal with this threat as …you do that at a community level. It’s about law enforcement working with communities leader, local leaders, community leaders were blogged  and identifying me. Structure and approach. Finding people who are susceptible to the radical message in dealing with it. If you don’t have that, you will lose now and for the future on us. So, I wanna see Congress instead of putting 1 ½ billion Dollars to the latest grant program  he will have netter  better. I want to come up with the creative approach of how do you fund community based efforts.  That is where the gold for this problem. I love to be part of the program. I smile eveytime. Ive seen how  your Al Queade operative disappears from the face of the earth because a predator, had a  titan solution of funding that. It’s not gonna solve the domestic problem folks. So, [0:53:28.1] [inaudible]   Security based effort number one.

Number 2, we need to have honest and mature driver now, but what happens after the next attack? Peter made a reference to this and I think it’s spot on. It is about  not over reacting. We need to recognize that the advantage is always with the attack. It’s always with the offence. Aaron Rogers demonstrated that last night in Super Bowl. But we need, we have this [0:54:04.8] [inaudible]   now, so God-forbid, there is a successful attack? What are we doing in response? And what are we not gonna do. I think that is as important as anything else. What we don’t do and don’t overreact. So that’s how the mature dialogue is very important for this domestic threat, cause as I said, of the three circles here, the one that we are at least quick to deal with is that last circle. I got to be a little more creative about how we do it.

Male speaker 3: Thanks! Thanks Roy…

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